Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by bpmod »

Fishercat wrote:
bpmod wrote:So, it's obtuse to say off the top of my head that I cannot think of a more distinctive island? It's obtuse not to first say to myself (while I am truly astounded that nobody on the show recognized Sicily) "wait, let's first think of every island in the world that might be recognizable from its postion against another body of land."

Sorry (that is, my personal apologies to you, Fishercat; nobody else seems to have taken offence) if I was in such a rush to express my disbelief.

They must have changed to definiton of 'obtuse' while I wasn't looking.

Brian
If you said at the beginning what you said right now, I wouldn't have said a thing. It's when go snide in response to my post (I'm sorry...), express disbelief no one knew it, and then claim that Sicily might be the most distinctive island in the world (when I can show that, based on the island itself, that doesn't hunt), and then go coy on what you actually mean is when you're being obtuse.
Again, it's being obtuse because I didn't say all of that at the very beginning? Do I need to start every post with "I am sorry, Fishercat, but I am stunned nobody got this"? I need to go through a list of every [*] in the world before I say that the one pictured is obvious? I know that I am not the smartest person here on JBoard, but I just cannot figure out how I have been either obtuse or coy.

You said that I was talking about the shape of the island. I never mentioned the shape of the island. You then said I was talking about the colouring of the isalnd. Again, I said no such thing. Go back and look at my first post on the topic. I said that, as I saw the clue, it was:
bpmod wrote: "Look at this island off the tip of Italy's toe. Name it."
I am not the only one here, nor was I even the first, to express disbelief that this was a TS. In fact, I haven't even been particularly harsh on the contestants (you said I mocked them; I did no such thing), relative to some of the words posted here, so I don't know why you need to go off on me like I have insulted you, the contestants and everybody else.

Brian
...but the senator, while insisting he was not intoxicated, could not explain his nudity.

If I had 50 cents for every math question I got right, I'd have $6.30 by now.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by bpmod »

Volante wrote:
bpmod wrote:
skullturf wrote:Image
And just what is that supposed to be?

I hope you know I'm pulling your leg.

Brian
Watch for splinters when you do that.
I see what you did there. Subtle. Very subtle.

Brian
...but the senator, while insisting he was not intoxicated, could not explain his nudity.

If I had 50 cents for every math question I got right, I'd have $6.30 by now.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by silverscreentest »

I've regularly read for high school and college tournaments. Any college team would have gotten that FJ. A good high school team would have gotten it, i.e., one that practices through the year, not just for their annual appearance on a television show. Three random college students I can see missing it, but not all three selected for the Jeopardy College Tournament. Over on the quizbowl boards there is an ongoing discussion about whether only things taught in high school should be asked in high school quizbowl. Someone pointed out that geography is hardly taught anymore. But geography is a subject quizbowl players love to learn on their own. The facts are simple and are of the type commonly asked in quizzes.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by georgespelvin »

This dismay about the lack of geography knowledge among college students is not new. When I was a freshman a LONG time ago, my Geology professsor gave everyone a map of the U.S. without the names of the states written in (but with lines delineating the states) and asked us to fill in the names. I don't remember how that turned out, but a lot of people had some trouble and my professor then went on a rant about how important it was to know geography. For the record, I mixed up New Hampshire and Vermont.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by alietr »

The Official JBoard Exchange rate is that one LOL can be exchanged for 5 paragraph marks.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Fishercat »

bpmod wrote:
Fishercat wrote: If you said at the beginning what you said right now, I wouldn't have said a thing. It's when go snide in response to my post (I'm sorry...), express disbelief no one knew it, and then claim that Sicily might be the most distinctive island in the world (when I can show that, based on the island itself, that doesn't hunt), and then go coy on what you actually mean is when you're being obtuse.
Again, it's being obtuse because I didn't say all of that at the very beginning? Do I need to start every post with "I am sorry, Fishercat, but I am stunned nobody got this"? I need to go through a list of every [*] in the world before I say that the one pictured is obvious? I know that I am not the smartest person here on JBoard, but I just cannot figure out how I have been either obtuse or coy.

You said that I was talking about the shape of the island. I never mentioned the shape of the island. You then said I was talking about the colouring of the isalnd. Again, I said no such thing. Go back and look at my first post on the topic. I said that, as I saw the clue, it was:
bpmod wrote: "Look at this island off the tip of Italy's toe. Name it."
I am not the only one here, nor was I even the first, to express disbelief that this was a TS. In fact, I haven't even been particularly harsh on the contestants (you said I mocked them; I did no such thing), relative to some of the words posted here, so I don't know why you need to go off on me like I have insulted you, the contestants and everybody else.

Brian
I'll try one more time without the anger.

You said this
Seriously, I don't know if there is a more distinctive island anywhere in the world.
If you meant "given contextual clues like being at the tip of Italy..." that's one thing, but you put it out there like that. When combined with the point above, I'm seeing a judgment cast, like others cast in this topic (as I said originally) on the intelligence/capabilities of the three contestants on stage that these three were so incapable as they could not identify the most distinctive island in world (you dismissed the volcano point as unnecessary to boot, Pun!)

I took issue, originally, with the qualification as most distinctive. Considering the question at hand (where you get an overhead view of the island) and that you're calling the island distinctive, what would be distinctive from that picture? The location near Italy's boot? Perhaps, but that's not an island descriptor. It's like saying Long Island's distinctive with NY in the picture v. LI being distinctive without NY in the picture. You have yet to say what made Sicily particularly distinctive to justify the disbelief. Additionally, you started your original post basically dismissing my attempt to defend these kids (who I bet feel bad enough already) from getting destroyed on here, starting with the "I'm sorry", ignoring the volcano issue (which may help or obfuscate depending on what volcanoes you go to, if at all), and then simplifying the question, before making a statement you've yet to support.

FWIW, there wasn't anything obtuse about the original post. My obtuse comment in reference to twice refusing to clarify on what you said while only saying something to the effect of "what did I say"

But hey, if you want me to, I'll be happy to call shit on the other people as well. People in general are being pretty harsh in this topic, and I doubt many of them would dare if the third post was from one of the contestants in this topic. It's funny how the tone here shifts so dramatically when a contestant shows up. Arthur Chu is here and some people critical of him are called trolls and piled on by the community here, but when no one's here, it's open season. (Just to clarify, as to not make this about Arthur, I'm a huge fan of his playstyle and was disappointed tonight was the college tournament instead of regular games, and I LOVE the college tournament).
Last edited by Fishercat on Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:23 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by ArthurChu »

Visual clues are actually the easiest kind of clue to "brainfart" on, in my experience playing Jeopardy at home and in real life. For me the "get" on this FJ was the fact that the island is 10,000 square miles (that's quite large and narrows the field considerably).

That plus the volcanism (Jeopardy has historically LOVED asking clues about Mt. Etna, it's like Jeopardy's favorite volcano) and the fact that it does look like it's right off of another landmass would be the tipoff for me. Actually instagetting it from the shape of the island would be tough -- I think I have the equivalent of face-blindness for geographical features.

For the record I have an easier time learning geography from flashcards than from maps, perhaps because I'm not a very visual learner, and a flashcard set of "World's 100 Largest Islands" is in many ways quite tiresome yet very useful for Jeopardy. It will, for instance, clue you in that Sicily is way bigger than Crete (Sicily is the world's 45th largest island at roughly 10,000 sq. mi, Crete is the world's 89th largest island at roughly 3,000 sq. mi).
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! »

georgespelvin wrote:I don't remember how that turned out, but a lot of people had some trouble and my professor then went on a rant about how important it was to know geography.
I would argue for most people it's completely unimportant and affects their lives virtually not at all. I'm good at geography, but I can't really see how it is the least bit important. Pure trivia, IMO.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Vanya »

I don't think it's harsh to express surprise/outrage at 3 contestants missing an easy clue. And it was easy. One contestant did get it right, but changed her mind. Some other misses were discouraging as well (Bo Derek, we hardly knew ye.)
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by georgespelvin »

This Is Kirk! wrote:
georgespelvin wrote:I don't remember how that turned out, but a lot of people had some trouble and my professor then went on a rant about how important it was to know geography.
I would argue for most people it's completely unimportant and affects their lives virtually not at all. I'm good at geography, but I can't really see how it is the least bit important. Pure trivia, IMO.
Actually, in the field of geology it's probably important (yes, you can look things up but that's true for anything). I'm sure that's what got my professor so annoyed. Of course, this was an intro course that many people were taking for a science requirement.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by John Boy »

soxfan99 wrote:I got the final, but not by the shape. I keyed in on, "small island with a well-known name and a famous volcano," and that led me quickly to Sicily.
I suppose that's one way. but we all learned to visualize Italy as a boot, with the toe "kicking" Sicily. To see a photo with enough of Italy visible to identify the "boot," and still not discern Italy and Sicily, was amazing. I saw the photo and turned to my wife and fearlessly predicted this would be a triple-Instaget for any trio of college students bright enough to pass the J! quiz. Guess I was a bit wrong with that prediction.

I predictably went 1/10 on the pop culture and bands categories, then still picked up enough Lach Trash on The Color Purple, East of Eden, Spartacus, drive, dungarees, Ravel, and Saber Dance ($8,600) to be in contention from the fourth podium going into FJ. The sole get FJ gave me the imaginary fourth-podium win, which rarely happens and (IMO) is the sign of a game not very well played overall. To happen in a tournament? Well, let's just hope the quality of play gets better.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Fishercat »

I'll just say one more thing about this FJ in general.

In the last college tournament, 2/3 got a geography question (FJ) with only seven potential answers wrong. 90% of this board got it right (based on MB's poll), and most of the early conversation centered around what TPH might have said to the question and whether he guessed. Very little of the derision.

I'm just surprised at the mass shock and surprising outrage over a TS on this (especially when two of them at least had a hint of it). I wouldn't be that surprised if it polls at or below 90%.

FWIW, Italy being a boot was pretty common term, but I can honestly say I was never taught at any school level that it was kicking Sicily. Take from that what you will.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by alietr »

I have to say, as one of the shockees, that we're expecting these contestants to be among the intellectual elite. I think if one or two missed it, people may have made some comments, but they wouldn't have been shocked. And I will add that by and large the comments have been respectful -- they've expressed surprise at them not knowing, but it hasn't been condescending or derisive.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by hanzz »

I have no dog in this fight but just a tangential point that I bet there would be a good number of laymen and even perhaps Jeopardy contestants that would still misidentify the island of Great Britain as "England" or "United Kingdom".
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Volante »

hanzz wrote:I have no dog in this fight but just a tangential point that I bet there would be a good number of laymen and even perhaps Jeopardy contestants that would still misidentify the island of Great Britain as "England" or "United Kingdom".
Perhaps, but that's slightly more forgivable since it's used wrong so commonly in the first place and you have to actually work to unlearn that.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Magna »

econgator wrote:
TenPoundHammer wrote:Anyone wanna explain Cal Tech for $1000, my only miss there? "Optiforce" doesn't sound remotely like a golf club to me, and "high tech" to me suggests something electronic, which would rule out about 99% of sports equipment. How do you get golf club out of that?! (And how was that clue not a TS when "drive" was?)
Callaway = golf clubs. You know it or you don't.
I got that one too, for the same reason. But, fwiw, "golf balls" wasn't a crazy response because Callaway sells those too.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by bpmod »

Fishercat wrote:You said this
Seriously, I don't know if there is a more distinctive island anywhere in the world.
OK. Then you said this:
Fishercat wrote:If you meant "given contextual clues like being at the tip of Italy..." that's one thing, but you put it out there like that. When combined with the point above, I'm seeing...t identify the most distinctive island in world (you dismissed the volcano point as unnecessary to boot, Pun!)

I took issue, originally, wi...uestion, before making a statement you've yet to support.

FWIW, there wasn't anything...what did I say"

But hey, if you want me to, I'll b...uge fan of his playstyle and was disappointed tonight was the college tournament instead of regular games, and I LOVE the college tournament).
Should I assume, because I only quoted a portion of your argument, that that was all you said?

And you call me obtuse.

Brian
...but the senator, while insisting he was not intoxicated, could not explain his nudity.

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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Magna »

TenPoundHammer wrote:
harrumph wrote:I think the Ravel's Bolero TS would have a shot at 100% in the weekly poll.
I knew it because I had been told that in 1996, Wheel of Fortune had "Composer/Song" as a category, and they only used it one time. I actually found a recap of that episode on alt.tv.game-shows, which stated that the answer was RAVEL'S BOLERO, and that the whole puzzle was filled in before it was solved. (And I certainly hope that, with the whole puzzle filled in, the contestant didn't pronounce it like "travel".)
Or Bolero like bowler-oh.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Fishercat »

I'll just leave that up there as a support to my point. I made a genuine effort to explain my point of view. You respond with that. How about we mutually block each other and move on with our lives.
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Re: Monday, February 10, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

Onto non-FJ matters...

Did anyone else start envisioning spinning plates on sticks at the mention of the Saber Dance?
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