Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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El Jefe
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Aberrant Errata

Post by El Jefe »

1) Earth to Alex: rapunzel lettuce Is A Thing; though it doesn't match the definition of a cylindrical head you don't have to remind people of the appropriate category of response because Arthur had it
2) If you're going to accept both ways of pronouncing Gerry (and you should) then just say 'or \gary\, since that's how he pronounced his name.' You're certainly not very consistent in pointing out correct pronunciations, previously failing to point out the 'correct' pronunciations of Halley and Thoreau
3) Clue research error- Diamond Foods dropped out of contention on buying Pringles and instead Kellogg ended up doing it
4) 'McDarmand' deserves a neg- no contest
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by MarkBarrett »

It would have been funny if the next clue after Sam Waterston was about the creator of Calvin & Hobbes.

Arthur: You were ringing in on the Purple Jesus/AP clue. You would have had it right? That's good that there is some hope for you in sports.

Cracker Jacks have four previous acceptances and a fifth clue has Cracker Jack with parentheses noting that the plural was acceptable as well. Tonight is one more instance where it won't be negged.

Five clues unseen? Tomorrow needs to be better.

No doubt just about every viewer picked up at least a piece of trash in the game. Besides others mentioned I'll add the Katy Perry album.

The FJ! clue had me stumped on first reading. Like others I pictured rescuing falling children to lead me to "catch." The Catcher in the Rye came to me immediately and I felt sure 1951 was the correct year. I could not have named the year for Catch-22 if that title had come to mind, but I would have known it was later.

Arthur: Did you consider going for 300K on the nose with the wiggle room available and a category that should not have been frightening?

Hammer: I'm with you handling the Snack Fact category without incident. I'm guilty of eating Pringles, Milky Way, Teddy Grahams, and one Twinkie at least once in the 2013-2014 period. Cracker Jack go further back in the century at some point.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by hscer »

MarkBarrett wrote: Arthur: Did you consider going for 300K on the nose with the wiggle room available and a category that should not have been frightening?
Obviously I can't actually answer this for him, but considering he did not bet a few shows ago to hit $60,000 (which he could easily have done safely) suggests to me he's not generally concerned about round numbers.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by dhkendall »

Interesting, it's well acknowledged around here that contradicting Alex is bad luck, you can kiss your Jeopardy career goodbye. Yet, this was probably the biggest contradiction of Alex we've seen in a very long time and Arthur got away with it! My theory is that, since saying the name of the Scottish Play in a theatre (which one could argue Arthur was in) is bad luck, maybe saying the play's name also counters the bad luck from contradicting Alex! (If I get on and happen to forget myself and contradict Alex, I'll test it by giving "Macbeth" as my next response).

I remember that scene from reading Catcher in junior high, was a very fascinating insight into Holden's psyche.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Jaksiel »

What a weird game. Arthur was definitely a lot more vulnerable than usual but his opponents could not take advantage. I picked up a LOT of Lach Trash in this game, making it probably the only time in his run that I could have potentially dethroned him (though with an easy FJ!, I would have had to had the lead).
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! »

I'll admit it. I had no idea what "Reddit AMA" or whatever it was meant. The clues weren't difficult, but I went in thinking it was going to be somehow related to the American Medical Association. I have heard of Reddit, just not AMA.

Totally blew FJ. "Catcher..." never entered my head. The best I could come up with was "The Magic Mountain."
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Golf »

Personally, I thought the Scottish Play response and commentary was a bit unnecessary. This is competition, just give the answer and collect the money.

On the other hand, I didn't really blame Arthur for being peeved at the McDormand/Gerrymandering sequence. After the Gerry contradiction I may have spoken Waterston over several seconds with a few expletives interspersed. I very rarely take issue with Alex's comments, but was not fond of this. If nothing else, the timing of it simply sucked. If you're a competitive soul crusher like Arthur has been, you take no shit during the game, not even from the host.

Can't wait to see the dynamic tomorrow.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by dhkendall »

Golf wrote:Personally, I thought the Scottish Play response and commentary was a bit unnecessary. This is competition, just give the answer and collect the money.
You think this is bad, the sound you heard was mbclev exploding! :)
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by UiscePreston »

mdude04 wrote:I brought up the Cracker Jack issue on the previous page. My take on it was that the clue was looking for a product and not an actual song lyric.

In my mind it would be like:
A) "It's the brand of car mentioned in the song 'American Pie."
vs
B) "It's the word that completes the line: 'Drove my ___ to the levy but the levy was dry.'"

"What is Chevrolet" would probably be accepted for A (as would, I assume, "What are Chevys," "What are Chevrolets," etc), but would be rejected as a response for B. Same here. It is common to refer to the snack as "Cracker Jacks," so it correctly answers the clue, regardless of what the exact song lyric is.
I completely agree. Along a similar but inverse line, my issue was with them accepting "What is 'the Scottish Play'?" when the clue clearly asked for "THIS THANE". To begin with, the pretentious circumlocution on the part of the contestant was entirely unnecessary. Just say "Macbeth". It must have been his bewildering but failed attempt at being clever that stunned the sense out of Alex and the judges, allowing him to correct his error. But "the Scottish Play" and "this thane" are not semantically equivalent in any sense whatsoever, and their sharing of an outwardly-similar sign is no justification to the contrary.

His initial response was incontrovertibly wrong. Suppose the clue was "IDENTIFY THIS PROMINENT BACKGROUND STRUCTURE OF AMERICAN GOTHIC BY GRANT WOOD" and the contestant said "What is 1600 Pennsylvania Ave?". Not a soul alive would rule that correct even though "this prominent background structure of American Gothic by Grant Wood" and "1600 Pennsylvania Ave." can both be represented by the same unmarked utterance [the white house]. Note how "the white house" and "the White House" are distinct. Only in certain contexts are they equivalent: The White House is the white house where the President resides, etc. Macbeth and Macbeth are not interchangeable even in context. Nor are any of their respective synonymous signs.
Last edited by UiscePreston on Tue Mar 11, 2014 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Golf »

dhkendall wrote:
Golf wrote:Personally, I thought the Scottish Play response and commentary was a bit unnecessary. This is competition, just give the answer and collect the money.
You think this is bad, the sound you heard was mbclev exploding! :)
No reason to flinch at that, happens several times a day.... :lol:
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by dhkendall »

UiscePreston wrote:
mdude04 wrote:I brought up the Cracker Jack issue on the previous page. My take on it was that the clue was looking for a product and not an actual song lyric.

In my mind it would be like:
A) "It's the brand of car mentioned in the song 'American Pie."
vs
B) "It's the word that completes the line: 'Drove my ___ to the levy but the levy was dry.'"

"What is Chevrolet" would probably be accepted for A (as would, I assume, "What are Chevys," "What are Chevrolets," etc), but would be rejected as a response for B. Same here. It is common to refer to the snack as "Cracker Jacks," so it correctly answers the clue, regardless of what the exact song lyric is.
I completely agree. Along a similar but inverse line, my issue was with them accepting "What is 'the Scottish Play'?" when the clue clearly asked for "THIS THANE". To begin with, the pretentious circumlocution on the part of the contestant was entirely unnecessary. Just say "Macbeth". It must have been his bewildering but failed attempt at being clever that stunned the sense out of Alex and the judges, allowing him to correct his error. But "the Scottish Play" and "this thane" are not semantically equivalent in any sense whatsoever, and their sharing of an identical sign is no justification to the contrary.

His initial response was incontrovertibly wrong. Suppose the clue was "IDENTIFY THIS PROMINENT BACKGROUND STRUCTURE OF AMERICAN GOTHIC BY GRANT WOOD" and the contestant said "What is 1600 Pennsylvania Ave?". Not a soul alive would rule that correct even though "this prominent background structure of American Gothic by Grant Wood" and "1600 Pennsylvania Ave." can both be represented by the same unmarked utterance [the white house]. Note how "the white house" and "the White House" are distinct. Only in certain contexts are they equivalent: The White House is the white house where the President resides, etc. Macbeth and Macbeth are not interchangeable even in context. Nor are any of their respective synonymous signs.
Good point, but Macbeth and Macbeth are pronounced the same way. He could have corrected himself from "The Scottish Play" to "Macbeth" instead of "Macbeth". (And, also, keep in mind, the theatrical curse applies to utterances of "Macbeth" as well as "Macbeth", although I don't know what the euphemism is for the former.)

But, yes, I think Arthur's attempt at wit really fell flat. And as a former standup comic, I am the board's resident expert on humour falling flat.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Bamaman »

I had Lord of the Flies on FJ. They use the book a lot on the show and had the description seemed to fit the story, thought its been about 30 years since I read either book.

They'd have finished the first round if Kirsten hadn't read her entire book during the interview.

Did Arthur foresee the national furor when he made that comment during his interview?

The whole Gerry thing was stupid of Alex. I can never remember if the hard g goes with the man's name or his political term.
Last edited by Bamaman on Thu Sep 15, 2022 5:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by lieph82 »

Well then...
Arthur's twitter wrote:Okay I'm going to be honest - the producer Maggie directly asked me to be a little more engaging and funny this ep and chaos ensued
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

Bamaman wrote:They'd have finished the first round if Kirsten hadn't read her entire book during the interview.
Half of that was Alex's fault for asking a followup question. Maybe he was trying to pep up the interview and end it on a humorous note. But he really didn't have time to ask if she knew all the town gossip and its dirty little secrets, let alone wait for a reply.

The correct reply to that query, by the way, is a total deadpan: "I'm sorry Alex. I must have inadvertently made the book sound more interesting than it is."

Mrs Penguin noticed that Alex consistently pronounced her name KEER-sten until the FJ reveal when he switched to KER-sten. In my mind I pictured her going up to Alex during the final break, grabbing him by the lapels and, with her face an inch from his, saying, "Look, buddy. Your and I are never going to see each other again. But the name's KER-sten. Got that? KER-sten."

Life is often so much more interesting in my head. I think it needs better writers.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by davey »

I don't believe Arthur corrected himself on "Freedmen's Bureau." Rather he articulated it better the second time, as Alex requested. I could have done without some other parts of this game: "The Scottish play," the banter, if that's what it was, over "Gerry," the over-articulation of "Waterston." The rolling-over of Arthur's opponents...
At least the FJ was easy...in fact, I could swear I've heard the clue before....
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Secretariat »

Lach Trash on Freehwheelin', Wish You Were Here, and Spike Lee tonight. Arthur has been shaky to start the last couple games.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Turd Ferguson »

davey wrote:I don't believe Arthur corrected himself on "Freedmen's Bureau." Rather he articulated it better the second time, as Alex requested.
I could certainly believe that he knew it was Freedmen's Bureau, and/or that it was what he was trying to say. But, he pretty clearly said "Freemen's Bureau". I heard it the first time, and went back on the PVR to confirm if I'd heard what I thought. If he knew he mis-spoke the first time and changed it when asked to repeat it... well... I'd like to think I wouldn't do that, but realistically can't say I know I wouldn't do the same.

On an unrelated note, I don't really agree with what seems to be the sentiment here that the way to beat Arthur is to "beat him at his own game". Generally speaking, in sports if you get your opponent to play "your game", you're already ahead. In preparing for my taping, I had a "gameplan" and I told myself not to adjust the plan no matter who I came up against. What some might see as being a "lamb for the slaughter", I would see as sticking with a plan, and not being intimidated by an opponent. (Of course for me that was moot when I got picked to play in the first game of the taping day)

While Arthur obviously has a strong knowledge base, he certainly hasn't been a lock on DDs, especially at the $1600/$2000 level. Missing DJ DDs has almost cost him the game a couple times already, and I don't think I'm exactly going out on a ledge to say that when he finally does lose, missing a key DD or two will likely be his downfall (as it was for Ken Jennings against Nancy Zerg).
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by ArthurChu »

I honestly believe that I did say Freedmen's Bureau the first time and just slurred the D, but of course I'm saying that months later and am a biased source.

Arguing about the interpretation of audio being what it is, the only argument I can offer in defense of this interpretation is that if I really did think it was "Freeman's Bureau" I'd be as likely to think Alex had heard a D in there where there wasn't supposed to be one as vice versa.

And yes the Scottish Play thing was stupid. Maggie specifically asked me to try to be a little more personable and charming this time around now that I'm already a "superchampion" so that I can try to charm America. It's the same reason we did that godawful thing where they put me on the spot to "do a voice". I regret all of it, and recommend that future Jeopardy champions avoid all conscious attempts to be personable and charming as if you are not actually personable and charming it is quite likely to backfire.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by davey »

I've listened to it several times myself. and I hear the "d."He doesn't come down hard on it, but I hear it. The closed captioner does too. He gets my benefit of the doubt on this one.
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Re: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by econgator »

ArthurChu wrote:I honestly believe that I did say Freedmen's Bureau the first time and just slurred the D, but of course I'm saying that months later and am a biased source.
I was certain I heard the "D" the first time you said it, so I'm with you on that one.
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