SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

This is where all of the games are discussed.

Moderators: alietr, trainman, econgator, dhkendall

Post Reply
User avatar
Woof
Swimming in the Jeopardy! Pool
Posts: 5125
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:53 pm

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Woof »

I too supplied outseam, for the simple expedient of my being sure that what was described wasn't the inseam. Toyed a while with simply supplying seam, but decided that that was asking for trouble. I'll be interested to hear what DoT was actually looking for there.
Peggles
Grand Exalted Queen of the Universe
Posts: 851
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 12:39 am
Location: Swansea, Massachusetts

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Peggles »

Woof wrote:I too supplied outseam, for the simple expedient of my being sure that what was described wasn't the inseam. Toyed a while with simply supplying seam, but decided that that was asking for trouble. I'll be interested to hear what DoT was actually looking for there.
I did exactly the same. I knew it wasn't inseam. I'd never actually heard of outseam, but I thought it made sense.
User avatar
Budphrey
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 720
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:29 pm

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Budphrey »

jeff6286 wrote:
4: With just over 44,000 people, Couer d'Alene is the second-largest city in this U. S. state.
I wanted to point out that this question, as written, has no correct answer. Couer D'Alene is not the second-largest city in Idaho. According to the 2010 Census, the top 5 cities in Idaho are Boise, Nampa, Meridian, Idaho Falls, and Pocatello, with populations of 205K, 81K, 75K, 56K, 54K. I assume that Couer D'Alene is probably 6th or 7th, but I couldn't find a definitive 2010 list other than the top 5. Couer D'Alene's metropolitan area is the second largest in the state, so that was what the question should have asked for.
QFT. Except let's spell it correctly: Coeur d'Alene. I have a sister living there, you know.

I also have a mild beef with the 2-point question in that round. It talks about the "underground" River Walk that obviously belongs to San Antonio. Except the San Antonio River Walk is entirely above ground. It just happens to be at the level of the river banks, which are 10 to 12 feet below street level. The river is generally not that deep but it's in a distinct natural gorge that runs through much of the city.
Poo-tee-weet? So it goes.
User avatar
Budphrey
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 720
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:29 pm

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Budphrey »

cinemaniax7 wrote:I know Coeur d'Alene from—what else?—a movie. The Coeur d'Alene reservation is featured in the independent film Smoke Signals, which is based on a story by Native American author Sherman Alexie.
Great movie. Short of having actual knowledge of Idaho, I think having a cognitive link to some aspect of life in the state through either Smoke Signals or Napoleon Dynamite is fairly noble.
Poo-tee-weet? So it goes.
User avatar
hbomb1947
Still hoping to get on Jeopardy! while my age is in double digits
Posts: 2434
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:31 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by hbomb1947 »

Woof wrote:I too supplied outseam, for the simple expedient of my being sure that what was described wasn't the inseam. Toyed a while with simply supplying seam, but decided that that was asking for trouble. I'll be interested to hear what DoT was actually looking for there.
Conversely, if "outseam" (a word that I, like many others here, have never heard of) was the intended answer, it ended up tricking a lot of people here, which I'm sure wasn't DoT's intention for a 6-point clue. For that reason, perhaps a replacement question would be warranted for those of us who answered "inseam."
Follow me on twitter, even though I rarely tweet! https://twitter.com/hbomb_worldwide
User avatar
thejeopardyfan
(Unranked)
Posts: 861
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 2:37 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by thejeopardyfan »

We don't know yet what DoT was going for, but I think most of you that said "inseam" just didn't read the clue carefully. The clue shouldn't be tossed for that.
Suze
Jeopardy! Contestant
Posts: 198
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:50 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Suze »

I wouldn't make that assumption. As far as I know, there isn't an "outseam." When I read the question, I thought it sounded funny, not like an inseam exactly. I considered putting "seam" but that didn't seem right either. Anyway, with this crowd, I wouldn't be assuming that everyone just didn't read the question closely enough. From the comments, lots of confusion here regardless of what people ended up putting.
User avatar
thejeopardyfan
(Unranked)
Posts: 861
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 2:37 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by thejeopardyfan »

Suze wrote:I wouldn't make that assumption. As far as I know, there isn't an "outseam." When I read the question, I thought it sounded funny, not like an inseam exactly. I considered putting "seam" but that didn't seem right either. Anyway, with this crowd, I wouldn't be assuming that everyone just didn't read the question closely enough. From the comments, lots of confusion here regardless of what people ended up putting.
Still, the clue definitely does not describe an inseam, whether or not there's such a word as "outseam."
Vanya
The support is non-zero
Posts: 2727
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 12:10 pm
Contact:

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Vanya »

This discussion of inseam reminds me of that Friends episode. "That's not how they do it?"
User avatar
DadofTwins
Watches Jeopardy! Way Too Much
Posts: 1206
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:11 am
Location: Fortress of SHC-itude
Contact:

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by DadofTwins »

Working on getting R3D1 up this afternoon.

"Outseam" is the intended R2D6 6-point answer, based on this: http://www.stainedglassbridalandtuxedo.net/tuxmea.html ("Outseam- An outseam measurement is obtained by beginning at the top of the waistline and bringing the tape down to where the pant should fall on the shoe; generally to the top of the heel.") and this: http://www.zootsuitstore.com/shopping/measure.asp (Take the tape and from the top of his pant line to the top of where the shoe meets the foot from the outside just below the ankle, add 1" and you have the pant outseam.)

I thought inseam would be obviously wrong since it measures form the crotch and not the waist, but apparently a lot of people didn't get that distinction.

Aside from "it's harder than I thought," is there anything that fatally flaws the clue to the point of needing an RQ?
nlw44
Swimming in the Jeopardy! Pool
Posts: 856
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:30 pm
Location: Harwich, MA

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by nlw44 »

DadofTwins wrote:Working on getting R3D1 up this afternoon.

"Outseam" is the intended R2D6 6-point answer, based on this: http://www.stainedglassbridalandtuxedo.net/tuxmea.html ("Outseam- An outseam measurement is obtained by beginning at the top of the waistline and bringing the tape down to where the pant should fall on the shoe; generally to the top of the heel.") and this: http://www.zootsuitstore.com/shopping/measure.asp (Take the tape and from the top of his pant line to the top of where the shoe meets the foot from the outside just below the ankle, add 1" and you have the pant outseam.)

I thought inseam would be obviously wrong since it measures form the crotch and not the waist, but apparently a lot of people didn't get that distinction.

Aside from "it's harder than I thought," is there anything that fatally flaws the clue to the point of needing an RQ?
Since I brought this up, I'll put in my two cents worth - no. Then again, I got it right (by pure WAG-ish good luck,) so my two cents might not be worth even that much. If you'd been trying for inseam, I'd have been adamantly on the yes side, but I shouldn't have doubted you.
"And has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!"
He chortled in his joy.

Lewis Carroll, "Jabberwocky"
User avatar
alietr
Site Admin
Posts: 8980
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:20 pm
Location: Bethesda, MD

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by alietr »

DadofTwins wrote:Aside from "it's harder than I thought," is there anything that fatally flaws the clue to the point of needing an RQ?
I got it wrong, and can't really quibble about it, except what would you use an outseam for? I've bought pants many, many times, and have never heard of an outseam, let alone having it used in the description and/or purchase of a pair of pants? For that matter, why is it a pair of pants?
User avatar
gnash
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 1678
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:24 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by gnash »

DadofTwins wrote:Aside from "it's harder than I thought," is there anything that fatally flaws the clue to the point of needing an RQ?
Um, how about the fact that the word is not in any mainstream dictionary? Not in any online (according to the onelook.com portal) and not in the (admittedly rather old) Random House Unabridged I have handy here.

ETA: One possible exception may be M-W, which doesn't list it in its free online version, but points to its pay version which defines it as "prickseam", which sounds painful.
User avatar
--Pete
Loyal Jeopardista
Posts: 116
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:55 pm
Location: Kent, Washington, USA

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by --Pete »

Hi,
alietr wrote: For that matter, why is it a pair of pants?
Because, originally, it was just the two legs, kinda like a pair of chaps. The center was covered by a flap in the back and a codpiece in front. Everything was more or less held in place with a belt.

--Pete
"We are looking over our new domicile,
If we like, we stay for maybe quite a while."
User avatar
Paucle
Trekardy! Writer
Posts: 3233
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:36 pm
Location: near Albany NY

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Paucle »

I clammed because I figured it had to be some sort of seam, knew it wasn't inseam, and didn't know any other seam terms. Not even prison ones, and their unusual way of getting an inseam (as per Ross). ;)
Never heard of "outseam" and I have a body type that requires alterations on almost every pants purchase.
Still, some players braver than me were able to infer the correct answer. They took a chance and got it right. I think an RQ would essentially punish them.
Last edited by Paucle on Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Paucle
Trekardy! Writer
Posts: 3233
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:36 pm
Location: near Albany NY

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by Paucle »

oh, and it's not in my World Book Dictionary (2 volume), 1964. And that has some AWESOME words in it. But maybe it's newer than that.
User avatar
gnash
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 1678
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:24 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by gnash »

Paucle wrote:oh, and it's not in my World Book Dictionary (2 volume), 1964. And that has some AWESOME words in it. But maybe it's newer than that.
The Random House I consulted is 1970. Yes, that's old. But has sartorial terminology changed? It tends to be very traditional.
NJCondon
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:25 pm
Location: Chicago, IL Area

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by NJCondon »

FWIW, I was measured for a tux by Men's Wearhouse two weeks ago, and my outseam was measured. My inseam was also measured, fortunately in a manner that did not warrant prosecution as sexual assault.
User avatar
hbomb1947
Still hoping to get on Jeopardy! while my age is in double digits
Posts: 2434
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:31 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by hbomb1947 »

Paucle wrote:Still, some players braver than me were able to infer the correct answer. They took a chance and got it right. I think an RQ would essentially punish them.
AFAIK, whether some players were able to correctly answer a flawed question has never been a criterion for whether an RQ gets issued. The invocation of the remedy does not "punish" those people; they still get the points and they don't have to worry about whether they can correctly answer the replacement clue.
Follow me on twitter, even though I rarely tweet! https://twitter.com/hbomb_worldwide
User avatar
TomKBaltimoreBoy
Lucky to be Here
Posts: 580
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:30 am

Re: SHC Round 2 Instant Replay Thread [SPOILERS]

Post by TomKBaltimoreBoy »

I would say that it merits an RQ because the clue doesn't match the definition you cited -- the definition refers to the waistline -- on the body -- as opposed to the waist (of the pants) --cited in the clue. As the only seam on a pair of pants involving the waist -- if there IS a waist, as others have noted -- is that between the waist and the legs, the clue was incorrectly worded.
Life IS pain, Princess. Anyone telling you differently is selling something.
Post Reply