J-archive spoilers

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JyV92
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J-archive spoilers

Post by JyV92 »

It’s 2 PM in Los Angeles. I went onto the J archive site to look something up and I see today’s game is up there already. Is this a policy, does anyone know, of the J-archive?

They seem to be very careful about not spoiling shows.

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MarkBarrett
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by MarkBarrett »

JyV92 wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 5:25 pm
It’s 2 PM in Los Angeles. I went onto the J archive site to look something up and I see today’s game is up there already. Is this a policy, does anyone know, of the J-archive?

They seem to be very careful about not spoiling shows.
Yes, the Archive may be so up-to-date that the current game for a particular day may already be archived by 10:00 a.m. Pacific. For some it is a blessing to be able to follow the game when there is a preemption or play through the clues during someone's lunch break for instance.

For others, it is not welcome to have the current FJ! clue right there on the front screen. If going to the current season then it may be easy to see a current champ has won again.

If the archiving of the games is too slow then complaints pour in about the Archive lagging for updates.

Each viewer has to use the site as works best for them while understanding that spoilers may be possible. Other sites & forums can set their own rules, such as nothing before 8 p.m. PT for that day's game.

On JBoard the daily thread is marked spoilers though it is open season once the game airs at 9:30 a.m. CT. Reddit has a daily dedicated thread as well. The Jeopardy! Fan is updated for the works by 8:30 a.m. PT each morning.

Sorry, you were spoiled, since I'm the efficient archivist responsible. My suggestion is to bookmark this kind of link: http://www.j-archive.com/showseason.php?season=35 From there you will not see the current FJ! clue and can avoid seeing the most current games while being able to look at other games and do a search.

The Archive can be a caveat emptor for visiting sometimes though the ability to still utilize the site is possible with the work around.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Golf »

C'mon archivists, use some common sense. Do not post the game until everybody has the opportunity to watch it on their local station. Including Hawaii and Alaska. Check the local TV listings to ensure the latest air time. Of course you also must pay attention to pre-emptions. On all local networks. If this happens, please take note of the new air time and wait until afterwards to post the game.

Furthermore, there are those who record the game but are unable to watch it until later that night. Do not post the game until all have watched their personal recording.

However, all games must be posted by midnight on each and every air date without exception, otherwise it's not fair to those who do not have access to a local airing.

Please follow all of the above rules, even if they conflict. No excuses.

JyV92
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by JyV92 »

Not upset - and I appreciate the work and if it's tnat up to date - then kudos.

Just surprised. Will avoid the site before the evening in future. or will not look too closely at the opening quesitons.

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Robert K S
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Robert K S »

Golf wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 6:03 pm
Check the local TV listings to ensure the latest air time.
Or you can check Matt's J! page to learn that eight stations air at 10:30 PM Eastern, the latest outside of late-night pre-emption airings.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by GoodStrategy »

Maybe modify the "Recent FJ!" on the Archive's front page not to show a same-day FJ! until the airings across the country are complete?

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Ironhorse »

Why not just not visit the Archive until watching that day's game?
Never been on J!, but once won a knockoff version that aired on local access TV.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by talkingaway »

GoodStrategy wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:35 am
Maybe modify the "Recent FJ!" on the Archive's front page not to show a same-day FJ! until the airings across the country are complete?
Let me say that I love the J! Archive, and appreciate all the work that goes into it....thanks to all who provide this invaluable resource.

I'd agree that perhaps delaying the "Recent Final Jeopardy!" box by at least one day (ie show Tuesday's FJ! on Wednesday at, say, sometime between 8-11 AM ET, or whenever the next episode is archived) would be nice - by then, almost everyone in the US except folks who've had J! preempted have had a chance to see the episode. Does the box really serve much of a purpose, other than to say, "Hey, this is the last episode we've archived!"? If someone wants to see if today's episode is archived, or actually see the most recent available FJ! clue, it's easy enough to bookmark the season 36 page and compare the top date to today's date.

I have no problem with the names on the archive page being revealed on, say, Tuesday morning before Tuesday evening's show. I'm not that invested in whether a champ gets overthrown, even in a Zuffranieri/Holzhauer situation.

That said, I have no idea how much of the J! Archive is automated, and if such a change would take 10,000 man-hours to fix, it would totally not be worth it. I've trained myself to focus on another part of the page so I can click on to season 36 (or wherever I want to go).

One random question - is it a "me thing" that the links to audio/visual clues in recent are down, or is it that they just aren't transcribed? I can see some screen caps from, say, a 2005 episode, but nothing from this season. It has zero effect on the 95% of the non-visual clues, and even in the 5% of clues where there is a visual cue, very often the cue is either wholly irrelevant, or just a small extra clue.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by This Is Kirk! »

Ironhorse wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:51 am
Why not just not visit the Archive until watching that day's game?
Agreed. This doesn't seem like a huge issue. Why would you go to the j-archive page for a day's game you didn't want to be spoiled on? It just doesn't make any sense to me.

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MinnesotaMyron
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by MinnesotaMyron »

This Is Kirk! wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:04 am
Ironhorse wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:51 am
Why not just not visit the Archive until watching that day's game?
Agreed. This doesn't seem like a huge issue. Why would you go to the j-archive page for a day's game you didn't want to be spoiled on? It just doesn't make any sense to me.
It's not quite that simple. Having the current day's match archived before noon, before it's aired in most of the country, is a very new development, and one which reasonably could cause consternation the first time you encounter it if you aren't expecting it. Any regular user of the Archive is well aware of the number of times we've been very behind, or even just a little behind, leaning on the "We're all volunteers" explanation. Well, this is the other side of that coin, and as welcome as regular archiving is, it's also a surprise for the casual user of the Archive.

While I absolutely appreciate Mark's stepping in to make sure the Archive is as current as can be, I think what the Archive's position as a spoiler space is, is worth some discussion.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by talkingaway »

This Is Kirk! wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:04 am
Ironhorse wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:51 am
Why not just not visit the Archive until watching that day's game?
Agreed. This doesn't seem like a huge issue. Why would you go to the j-archive page for a day's game you didn't want to be spoiled on? It just doesn't make any sense to me.
Maybe people are on mobile devices at lunch and don't have access to today's episode until 7:30, and want to "play J!" with one of the old shows, but would prefer to watch J! when it comes on (or on DVR) to make timing themselves easy for FJ!. Granted, the workaround of bookmarking the list of seasons on http://www.j-archive.com/listseasons.php does fix that easily. My personal opinion is that it would be nice for the "front door" of the Archive to be relatively spoiler-free, but everyone uses the archive differently. A spoiler-free link to the most recent show available - instead of revealing the FJ! clue - would be nice, as I do imagine that many people want to go to the most recent game.

Again, just a suggestion, since I really do love the J! Archive - and I agree that it's nit-picking and not a huge issue. It's pretty easy to do what I want on the screen and avoid looking to the left.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Volante »

Well, since this keeps going... the way I'd go would put the latest FJ and category behind a javascript clickwall like what's used to lock the response on a game page.
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by econgator »

Volante wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:54 am
Well, since this keeps going... the way I'd go would put the latest FJ and category behind a javascript clickwall like what's used to lock the response on a game page.
Is that really even a spoiler? Fine, so you see the category and clue a few hours before you normally would but so what? Even if you decide to look at the correct response, it doesn't give away anything about the bets or who won.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Robert K S »

From the very beginning the Archive has been a spoiler zone that the user visits at own risk. That said, if there was some time of the day that we could with near total consensus agree is the time when a spoiler veil should be lifted on a new day's entry, I might consider taking the effort to program such a veil.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by opusthepenguin »

econgator wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:00 pm
Volante wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:54 am
Well, since this keeps going... the way I'd go would put the latest FJ and category behind a javascript clickwall like what's used to lock the response on a game page.
Is that really even a spoiler? Fine, so you see the category and clue a few hours before you normally would but so what? Even if you decide to look at the correct response, it doesn't give away anything about the bets or who won.
To me it's a huge spoiler. I like to see the FJ in game conditions for my own participation, irrespective of player totals. I want to see the category and think about it a tiny bit while I fast-forward through the ads. Then I want to see the clue revealed and have exactly the length of the Think music to settle on and "write down" a response. Only if I get FJ under these conditions do I feel fully justified in clicking the box on the weekly poll.

So, for example, I've occasionally accidentally clicked on the day's JBoard game thread before seeing the game. And I've scrolled down and read the FJ clue before realizing what I was looking at. In those cases I try to give myself 30 seconds to solve the clue right then. But of course I don't have a stopwatch on me and I'm not mentally prepared to go into FJ mode, so it's not a great situation. In that case I have no one to blame but myself. The thread title warned me. I know how this site operates. If the same rules apply to j-archive now as well, I can live with that and get used to it. J-archive is a national treasure and I'm not going to cavil at it over a minor inconvenience. I think everyone in this thread agrees on that point. But I also agree with those who would be glad to see some spoiler-avoidance mechanism introduced IFF it's possible without a lot of trouble.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Golf »

This thread has turned completely asinine, and it's insulting to the archivists who spend countless hours ensuring both the current games as well as games from early seasons get put in. There is absolutely no reason for some silly safeguard to be put on the archive so a few people don't get spoiled on rare occasion.

I think it's awesome that a game can be input shortly after the first airing. Because I know it can take 1-2 hours per game. And there's archivists who I'm sure have put in hundreds of games. How many hours is that? And for all that work they get those who complain when games aren't put in fast enough, and now that games are put in too fast.

There's countless ways to access the archive and not get spoiled. How about those worried about getting spoiled figure out one of them instead of asking others to put in more work to appease you. And if you do happen to get spoiled, big fat hairy deal. People act as though it's the end of the world to get spoiled on 1 clue of 61 from 1 of 230 games per year.

Archivists, thank you for your work and passion in regards to the archive. And hopefully you don't let a few people get you down. Robert, please don't waste time thinking and implementing a solution to this non-problem. It's not worth it.

Just my two cents.

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by OntarioQuizzer »

Robert K S wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:03 pm
From the very beginning the Archive has been a spoiler zone that the user visits at own risk. That said, if there was some time of the day that we could with near total consensus agree is the time when a spoiler veil should be lifted on a new day's entry, I might consider taking the effort to program such a veil.
For what it's worth, the show, under normal circumstances, embargoes press releases about specific episodes until 7:30 PM Eastern the night of airing. That might be a reasonable accommodation here.
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by MinnesotaMyron »

OntarioQuizzer wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:01 pm
Robert K S wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:03 pm
From the very beginning the Archive has been a spoiler zone that the user visits at own risk. That said, if there was some time of the day that we could with near total consensus agree is the time when a spoiler veil should be lifted on a new day's entry, I might consider taking the effort to program such a veil.
For what it's worth, the show, under normal circumstances, embargoes press releases about specific episodes until 7:30 PM Eastern the night of airing. That might be a reasonable accommodation here.
I was also concerned about this, vis a vis recent discussions of copyright infringement. At what point does a basically complete transcript of the day's show become competition?

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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by hbomb1947 »

OntarioQuizzer wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:01 pm
Robert K S wrote:
Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:03 pm
From the very beginning the Archive has been a spoiler zone that the user visits at own risk. That said, if there was some time of the day that we could with near total consensus agree is the time when a spoiler veil should be lifted on a new day's entry, I might consider taking the effort to program such a veil.
For what it's worth, the show, under normal circumstances, embargoes press releases about specific episodes until 7:30 PM Eastern the night of airing. That might be a reasonable accommodation here.
I don't see why that's necessary when the results of the show already appear on this board, on the J! subreddit, and on TJF in late morning of the day an episode airs (i.e., after it airs in the Birmingham market). So the information is already out there, for those who care to look for it, hours before 7:30 pm.
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Re: J-archive spoilers

Post by Robert K S »

The timing of archiving has never been a competition and never will be because it's also about reliability and sustainability. In a month from now the Archive will have been doing it for 15 years. (That's a pretty good run for any website. Most of my favorite websites never lasted that long.)

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